From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 5 18:06:37 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169162-3>; Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:06:29 -0500 Received: from condor.CC.UMontreal.CA ([132.204.2.103]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <33>; Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:00:48 -0500 Received: from eole.ERE.UMontreal.CA by condor.CC.UMontreal.CA with SMTP id AA00619 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Wed, 6 Jan 1993 22:58:36 GMT Received: from brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA by eole.ERE.UMontreal.CA (920330.SGI/5.17) id AA09146; Wed, 6 Jan 93 17:58:34 -0500 Received: by brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA (920330.SGI/5.17) id AA01191; Wed, 6 Jan 93 17:58:33 -0500 From: dionf@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Francois Dion) Message-Id: <9301062258.AA01191@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA> Subject: Questions about Roland Samplers... To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 17:58:33 -0500 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Status: RO Hi, I just joined the list because i'm loosing my Ensoniq 16+ this month and i need to buy another keyboard RSN. I have a Roland HS-60 (DCA synth) and a GUS so can i manage some stuff, but i need a sampler synth with lots of flexibility. Now, i would like to know the advantages of the different Roland synths, actual prices (Canadian $ or US $), problems, samples libraries... Thanks, -- Francois Dion ' _ _ _ CISM (_) (_) _) FM Montreal , Canada Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA (_) / . _) 10000 Watts Telephone no: (514) 343-7511 _______________________________________________________________________________ Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 5 18:24:11 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169178-2>; Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:24:01 -0500 Received: from gould.encore.com ([129.91.131.1]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <38>; Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:20:55 -0500 Received: from ranger.encore.COM by gould.encore.com with SMTP id AA27710 (5.64+/UK-2.1-921222); Tue, 5 Jan 93 18:19:34 -0500 Received: by ranger.encore.com id AA09989 (5.54/UK-2.1-910806); Tue, 5 Jan 93 18:16:21 EST From: Don Law Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1993 18:16:21 -0500 Message-Id: <9989.9301052316@ranger.encore.com> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: Questions about Roland Samplers... Status: RO > From: dionf@ere.umontreal.ca (Francois Dion) > Now, i would like to know the advantages of the different Roland synths ... The Roland S-10 has the advantage of using 2.8 inch diskettes. This advanced storage technology takes up 20% less space than the 3.5 inch diskette-for-the-common-man. And they are readily available from your local typewriter dealer. Sure, they cost 3 times as much, but you get what you pay for, right? Another advantage of owning an S-10 is that you are cut off from the s-group library, forcing you to be more creative in your sample sources. Things like Smith-Corona typewriters, screams as precious 2.8 inch disks go bad, etc. 8-) Sorry folks - I'm buried in meaningless paperwork right now and I needed a little release. In case you don't know by now, the above paragraph is sattire and should not be taken seriously. -- Don Law dlaw@gould.encore.com -- Ada Development, MS404 ...!uunet!gould!dlaw -- Encore Computer Corporation -- 6901 West Sunrise Blvd. ***** In the computer lab, ***** -- Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33313 ***** No one can hear you scream. ***** From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 6 01:22:13 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169241-3>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 01:22:03 -0500 Received: from world.std.com ([192.74.137.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <48>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 01:18:46 -0500 Received: by world.std.com (5.65c/Spike-2.0) id AB25371; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 01:18:29 -0500 Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 01:14:23 -0500 From: michael gary moncur Subject: Re: Questions about Roland Samplers... To: SGroup Post In-Reply-To: <9989.9301052316@ranger.encore.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO On Tue, 5 Jan 1993, Don Law wrote: > The Roland S-10 has the advantage of using 2.8 inch diskettes. This > advanced storage technology takes up 20% less space than the 3.5 inch > diskette-for-the-common-man. And they are readily available from your > local typewriter dealer. Sure, they cost 3 times as much, but you get > what you pay for, right? Another advantage of owning an S-10 is that you > are cut off from the s-group library, forcing you to be more creative > in your sample sources. Things like Smith-Corona typewriters, screams > as precious 2.8 inch disks go bad, etc. 8-) On an aside, it should be mentioned that you can also buy S-10 compatible disks at your local Radio Shack... The price? Merely a horrendous... get ready for this... $16.95 per two-pack. I'm so glad I upgraded to an S330... Although I wish I had kept the S10, since it's a much better keyboard controller than the Casio I use... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 6 11:51:54 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168618-3>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:51:46 -0500 Received: from husc8.harvard.edu ([128.103.25.8]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <41>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:47:46 -0500 Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:47:33 -0500 From: henrik@husc.harvard.edu Message-Id: <9301061647.AA29389@husc8.harvard.edu> To: mgm@world.std.com Cc: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca In-Reply-To: michael gary moncur's message of Wed, 6 Jan 1993 01:14:23 -0500 Subject: Questions about Roland Samplers... Status: RO i still have two s-10's - i love 'em. quick-disks or no, they're great, not-too-expensive samplers. 'course, with an s-50, too, i do most of my sampling work on it, but I use the s-10's primarily for choir and piano sounds, and the occasional dijeridu (we made a sample off an old Kate Bush record). larry... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 6 11:58:55 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168625-2>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:58:50 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Wed, 6 Jan 93 11:58:48 -0500 Received: from griffin.emba.uvm.edu ([132.198.1.11]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <72>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:55:39 -0500 Received: by griffin.emba.uvm.edu id AA14027 (5.65/1.11); Wed, 6 Jan 93 11:55:07 -0500 Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 11:55:07 -0500 From: coan@uvm-gen.EMBA.UVM.EDU Message-Id: <9301061655.AA14027@griffin.emba.uvm.edu> To: sgroup@lotus Subject: stretching (?) samples on a W-30 Status: RO Hey, I was wondering, say I sample a beat at its lenght is, say, 200000 and then i sample a guitar riff that's 2105674 in length. Is there any way to stretch the beat (or compress the riff) so that the lengths are equal? Does that question make sense?? Brian aka coan@emba.uvm.edu From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 6 14:00:08 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169356-3>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:00:04 -0500 Received: from usl.com ([147.2.200.17]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <75>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:56:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:55:00 -0500 From: gfd@usl.com (George Demarest +1 908 522 6363) To: coan@uvm-gen.EMBA.UVM.EDU, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: stretching (?) samples on a W-30 Received: from usl by usl.com; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:55 EST Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1098 Message-Id: <93Jan6.135625est.75@lotus.uwaterloo.ca> Status: R > Hey, I was wondering, say I sample a beat at its lenght is, say, 200000 and > then i sample a guitar riff that's 2105674 in length. Is there any way to > stretch the beat (or compress the riff) so that the lengths are equal? > > Does that question make sense?? > > Brian aka coan@emba.uvm.edu Yes, this makes sense. There are two ways to get around it (pretty much). One is to play the guitar sample slightly faster: thus the pitch will change. This may or may not be acceptable. The other requires either time compression of time expansion software (either on the sampler or on a computer. This, of course, means that you must either have a sampler with this feature, or a sample editting program. Digidesigns's Sound Tools has this feature and I'm pretty sure that most sample editting software has this. Beware, the results are not always great. If you wish to change the length by more than 5% or so, there begins noticable degredation and distortion of the original sound. Given a choice, I would probably slow the beat down by playing at a lower pitch. Hope this helps. gfd From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 6 14:25:33 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169368-1>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:25:31 -0500 Received: from volitans.MorningStar.Com ([137.175.2.11]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <77>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 14:22:05 -0500 Received: from trigger.morningstar.com by volitans.MorningStar.Com (5.65a/92122901) id AA05174; Wed, 6 Jan 93 14:20:10 -0500 Received: by trigger.MorningStar.Com (5.65a/92122901) id AA14636; Wed, 6 Jan 93 14:20:07 -0500 Received: by david.roth-music.com (uA-1.5v4); Wed, 6 Jan 93 13:54:34 EST From: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: stretching (?) samples on a W-30 Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 13:54:34 -0500 Organization: DAVID A. ROTH MUSIC Reply-To: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) Message-Id: <0105009A.n158ph@david.roth-music.com> X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v4 Status: R In Regards to your letter <9301061655.AA14027@griffin.emba.uvm.edu>: > > Hey, I was wondering, say I sample a beat at its lenght is, say, 200000 and > then i sample a guitar riff that's 2105674 in length. Is there any way to > stretch the beat (or compress the riff) so that the lengths are equal? > > Does that question make sense?? > > Brian aka coan@emba.uvm.edu It makes a lot of sense, however if the W-30 has the same software as the S-330 than you can't do time compressions or expansions. With something like Sound Tools you could do this with the help of Sound Designer I believe. You might be able to do this on the S-7xx models though. Anyone know? David david@roth-music.com From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 6 23:51:16 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169531-2>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:51:03 -0500 Received: from world.std.com ([192.74.137.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <81>; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:45:49 -0500 Received: by world.std.com (5.65c/Spike-2.0) id AA06109; Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:45:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 6 Jan 1993 23:44:05 -0500 From: michael gary moncur Subject: Re: Questions about Roland Samplers... To: SGroup Post In-Reply-To: <9301061647.AA29389@husc8.harvard.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: R On Wed, 6 Jan 1993 henrik@husc.harvard.edu wrote: > > i still have two s-10's - i love 'em. quick-disks or no, they're great, > not-too-expensive samplers. 'course, with an s-50, too, i do most of my > sampling work on it, but I use the s-10's primarily for choir and piano Sure, and S10 is nice if it's inexpensive... I paid $1400 for mine, though. Granted, that was long ago... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 00:10:47 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169539-3>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 00:10:43 -0500 Received: from pg2-srv.wam.umd.edu ([128.8.73.9]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <90>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 00:07:28 -0500 Received: from rac1.wam.umd.edu by pg2-srv.wam.umd.edu with SMTP id AA02214 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Thu, 7 Jan 1993 00:06:32 -0500 Received: by rac1.wam.umd.edu id AA17988 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Thu, 7 Jan 1993 00:06:14 -0500 Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 00:06:14 -0500 From: "196 lbs. of manhood" Message-Id: <199301070506.AA17988@rac1.wam.umd.edu> To: mgm@world.std.com, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: Questions about Roland Samplers... Status: R As an S-10 owner, and programmer, I'm curious as to how many S-10 users are still out there actively using theirs. I am wondering because I am thinking about writing an editor for the S-10, and I'd like to get some input.... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 04:44:32 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <167985-2>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:44:21 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <100>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:40:53 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA01832; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:40:33 +0100 Received: from mavros.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA03873; Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:40:31 +0100 Received: by mavros.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA11752; Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:40:24 +0100 Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:40:24 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301070940.AA11752@mavros.nada.kth.se> To: coan@uvm-gen.EMBA.UVM.EDU, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: stretching (?) samples on a W-30 Status: R Well, what you want to do is a sample rate conversion at the ratio 200000:213427 (or whatever) I don't know about the W-30; I think it can only do fixed sample rate conversion :-( Cheers, / h+ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 04:59:06 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168004-3>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:58:57 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 7 Jan 93 04:58:53 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <102>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:55:58 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA03041; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:55:50 +0100 Received: from mavros.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA04061; Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:55:48 +0100 Received: by mavros.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA11766; Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:55:38 +0100 Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 04:55:38 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301070955.AA11766@mavros.nada.kth.se> To: coan@uvm-gen.EMBA.UVM.EDU, gfd@usl.com, sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: stretching (?) samples on a W-30 Status: R Digidesigns's Sound Tools has this feature and I'm pretty sure that most sample editting software has this. Beware, the results are not always great. If you wish to change the length by more than 5% or so, there begins noticable degredation and distortion of the original sound. Well, the time stretch of SoundTools sounds like p*ss. The Roland S-750 has a much better time compress/expand, as has the program "Time Bandit" from Steinberg. Or you could just resample the guitar riff at a slightly lower sample rate (SoundTools can do that) and then tune the sample to the keyboard differently. Now, where are everybody's sound bites? I was promised one by Terje... Cheers, / h+ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 10:44:26 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168321-1>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:44:17 -0500 Received: from gould.encore.com ([129.91.131.1]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <106>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:40:21 -0500 Received: from ranger.encore.COM by gould.encore.com with SMTP id AA01458 (5.64+/UK-2.1-921222); Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:38:23 -0500 Received: by ranger.encore.com id AA04270 (5.54/UK-2.1-910806); Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:39:58 EST From: Don Law Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:39:58 -0500 Message-Id: <4270.9301071539@ranger.encore.com> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: S-10 usage Status: R > As an S-10 owner, and programmer, I'm curious as to how many S-10 users are > still out there actively using theirs. I have fun complaining about the quickdisks, but I really like my S-10. It serves me well, especially for the (used) price. It is the only sampler in our band and it fits the bill that nothing else can. -- Don Law dlaw@gould.encore.com -- Ada Development, MS404 ...!uunet!gould!dlaw -- Encore Computer Corporation -- 6901 West Sunrise Blvd. ***** In the computer lab, ***** -- Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33313 ***** No one can hear you scream. ***** From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 11:03:00 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168328-1>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:02:50 -0500 Received: from condor.CC.UMontreal.CA ([132.204.2.103]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <109>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:59:33 -0500 Received: from eole.ERE.UMontreal.CA by condor.CC.UMontreal.CA with SMTP id AA05989 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Thu, 7 Jan 1993 15:57:08 GMT Received: from brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA by eole.ERE.UMontreal.CA (920330.SGI/5.17) id AA16920; Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:57:06 -0500 Received: by brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA (920330.SGI/5.17) id AA21456; Thu, 7 Jan 93 10:57:05 -0500 From: dionf@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Francois Dion) Message-Id: <9301071557.AA21456@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA> Subject: Re: S-10 usage To: don@encore.com (Don Law) Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 10:57:05 -0500 Cc: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca In-Reply-To: <4270.9301071539@ranger.encore.com>; from "Don Law" at Jan 7, 93 10:39 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Status: R Beyond the ultraworld of Don Law: > > I have fun complaining about the quickdisks, but I really like my S-10. > It serves me well, especially for the (used) price. It is the only And what price is that? Also, is it a 16 bit or 12 bit sampler? If you have a sequencer, can you simply boot the OS and forget the floppy after that, transferring samples thru sysex, or is it really faster thru floppy (on the EPS 16+ it's really faster). Does the S-10 compares to an EPS 16+? If not which Roland compares, and for how much? (23 days left with my EPS 16+.... sniff) Ciao, -- Francois Dion ' _ _ _ CISM (_) (_) _) FM Montreal , Canada Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA (_) / . _) 10000 Watts Telephone no: (514) 343-7511 _______________________________________________________________________________ Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 11:25:33 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168342-2>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:25:27 -0500 Received: from att.att.com ([192.20.239.131]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <110>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:22:20 -0500 From: wbf@alux1.att.com Received: by alux1 (4.1/DCS-alux1-120392) id AA00639; Thu, 7 Jan 93 11:17:25 EST Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:17:25 -0500 Original-From: alux1!wbf (William Fox) Message-Id: <9301071617.AA00639@alux1> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Status: R Subject: How do you loose a synth and know about it in advance? Francois Dion wrote: ' > (23 days left with my EPS 16+.... sniff) Where is it going? Bill From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 11:31:54 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168352-2>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:31:44 -0500 Received: from gould.encore.com ([129.91.131.1]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <115>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:27:25 -0500 Received: from ranger.encore.COM by gould.encore.com with SMTP id AA01825 (5.64+/UK-2.1-921222); Thu, 7 Jan 93 11:25:13 -0500 Received: by ranger.encore.com id AA04445 (5.54/UK-2.1-910806); Thu, 7 Jan 93 11:26:48 EST From: Don Law Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:26:48 -0500 Message-Id: <4445.9301071626@ranger.encore.com> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: S-10 usage Status: R I got my S-10 for about $450 as I remember, including the Roland sample library. I was happy. I think it is 12 bits - I don't have the manual with me here at the office. > If you have a sequencer, can you simply boot the OS > and forget the floppy after that, This is my dream. There is no OS to boot - it runs from ROM. I'm still working on downloading samples in my sequences. Does anybody currently do this? --Don From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 12:02:16 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168365-1>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 12:02:07 -0500 Received: from condor.CC.UMontreal.CA ([132.204.2.103]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <127>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:57:12 -0500 Received: from eole.ERE.UMontreal.CA by condor.CC.UMontreal.CA with SMTP id AA06702 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:55:10 GMT Received: from brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA by eole.ERE.UMontreal.CA (920330.SGI/5.17) id AA26522; Thu, 7 Jan 93 11:55:08 -0500 Received: by brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA (920330.SGI/5.17) id AA24577; Thu, 7 Jan 93 11:55:08 -0500 From: dionf@ERE.UMontreal.CA (Francois Dion) Message-Id: <9301071655.AA24577@brise.ERE.UMontreal.CA> Subject: Re: your mail To: wbf@alux1.att.com Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 11:55:08 -0500 Cc: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca In-Reply-To: <9301071617.AA00639@alux1>; from "wbf@alux1.att.com" at Jan 7, 93 11:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Status: R Beyond the ultraworld of wbf@alux1.att.com: > > Subject: How do you loose a synth and know about it in advance? > > (23 days left with my EPS 16+.... sniff) > > Where is it going? The synth is propriety of my cousin. He's getting it back at the end of the month. I've had it for several months now, so i'm hooked. I need a sampling keyboard. Ciao, -- Francois Dion ' _ _ _ CISM (_) (_) _) FM Montreal , Canada Email: CISM@ERE.UMontreal.CA (_) / . _) 10000 Watts Telephone no: (514) 343-7511 _______________________________________________________________________________ Audio-C-DJ-Fractals-Future-Label-Multimedia-Music-Radio-Rave-Video-VR-Volvo-... From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 13:13:11 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168682-2>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 13:13:04 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 7 Jan 93 13:13:01 -0500 Received: from ugw.utcs.utoronto.ca ([128.100.102.3]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <129>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 13:10:00 -0500 Received: from BRUFSC.BITNET by ugw.utcs.utoronto.ca with BSMTP id <9329>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 13:09:19 -0500 Received: by BRUFSC (Mailer R2.08) id 7217; Thu, 07 Jan 93 14:19:27 BDB Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 09:09:45 -0500 From: Flavio Bressan da Luz <87141167%brufsc.bitnet@utcs.utoronto.ca> Organization: Universidade Federal de Santa Catarina/BRASIL Subject: Re: stretching samples in S-family To: sgroup@lotus Message-Id: <93Jan7.130919est.9329@ugw.utcs.utoronto.ca> Status: R Hello Brian, In the S770, S750 this is not a problem, but in the old S50, S550, S330, W30 there is no such feature in the system disk. A alternative is to get a sample editing software and then transfer the sample to software, edit it and transfer back to sampler. The problem is: How to transfer samples if the old S family haven't MIDI sample dump feature? One of the answers is get the program SAMDISK, available by ftp at sgroup site. This software, for IBM PC, read S-series disks. Then, in the IBM, you will need a software to adapt the file standard to the format of the sample editing software, or to transfer the file to another computer via MIDI sample dump. Someone knows if such program already exists? Hope this helps, Flavio P.s.: My samdisk copy still not works... ;-( From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 14:08:05 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169620-2>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:07:55 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 7 Jan 93 14:07:44 -0500 Received: from gould.encore.com ([129.91.131.1]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <130>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:04:34 -0500 Received: from ranger.encore.COM by gould.encore.com with SMTP id AA03749 (5.64+/UK-2.1-921222); Thu, 7 Jan 93 14:03:07 -0500 Received: by ranger.encore.com id AA04880 (5.54/UK-2.1-910806); Thu, 7 Jan 93 14:04:42 EST From: Don Law Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:04:42 -0500 Message-Id: <4880.9301071904@ranger.encore.com> To: sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: stretching samples in S-family Status: R > From: Flavio Bressan da Luz <87141167%brufsc.bitnet@utcs.utoronto.ca> > The problem is: How to transfer samples if the old S family haven't > MIDI sample dump feature? I got my S-10 (is that in the "old" S family?) to dump its sample to MIDI using some key sequence that I found playing around. I couldn't find it in the manual. I think it is something like press MIDI while holding down F1. --Don Law From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 20:53:30 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169785-1>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:53:22 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 7 Jan 93 20:53:20 -0500 Received: from world.std.com ([192.74.137.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <142>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:45:03 -0500 Received: by world.std.com (5.65c/Spike-2.0) id AA12050; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:44:02 -0500 Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 20:39:55 -0500 From: michael gary moncur Subject: Re: S-10 usage To: SGroup Post In-Reply-To: <4445.9301071626@ranger.encore.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: RO On Thu, 7 Jan 1993, Don Law wrote: > > If you have a sequencer, can you simply boot the OS > > and forget the floppy after that, > > This is my dream. There is no OS to boot - it runs from ROM. I'm still > working on downloading samples in my sequences. Does anybody currently > do this? I and my friend used to store S10 samples on Atari ST disks, and I wrote (co-wrote, actually) a program to dump them back and forth. Problem is, this won't work during a sequence - It takes about 35 seconds (!) for a 1-second sample to transmit, and sysex messages take over MIDI completely - no other instruments can play during the dump. I considered keeping S330 samples on my hard drive and du{ping them, until I realized how long a transfer would take...{ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 8 11:19:02 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168428-1>; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 11:18:59 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Fri, 8 Jan 93 11:18:53 -0500 Received: from ifi.uio.no ([129.240.64.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <27>; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 11:13:02 -0500 Received: from [129.240.4.184] by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 17:12:34 +0100 Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 11:12:34 -0500 Message-Id: <199301081612.AAifi.uio.no22476@ifi.uio.no> To: sgroup@lotus From: Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no (Thomas Flemming) X-Sender: thomasfl@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Mac-format? Status: RO >What kind of format your Mac sounds are? In nic.funet.fi there >was something that had a name extension ".sit", but they didn't >sound ok with my program. Is that ".sit" file type common, >and do you know anything about it? And what other sound formats >there are for Mac? I4m not sure what format standard Mac sound is, but there is a neat little program called "Sample Editor" that lets you save files in AIFF format. This should be eatable? Sample Editor can paste sounds from the clipboard. Please contact me if you dont have it. Soon maybe we can be snatching sounds from games with resEdit! -Thomas Flemming From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 8 11:43:29 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168697-1>; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 11:43:25 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <29>; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 11:40:31 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA26018; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 17:39:48 +0100 Received: from dront.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA21013; Fri, 8 Jan 93 17:39:47 +0100 Received: by dront.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA29681; Fri, 8 Jan 93 17:39:17 +0100 Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 11:39:17 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301081639.AA29681@dront.nada.kth.se> To: Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: Mac-format? Status: RO > Is that ".sit" file type common Yes, it's a common archiver (StuffIt) for Macs; you need to unpack them first using StuffIt on a Mac or unsit on a unix box. Also, beware that they may be sound resource or AIFF files. Cheers, / h+ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 8 21:07:45 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168863-3>; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:07:36 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Fri, 8 Jan 93 21:07:24 -0500 Received: from volitans.MorningStar.Com ([137.175.2.11]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <146>; Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:04:01 -0500 Received: from trigger.morningstar.com by volitans.MorningStar.Com (5.65a/92122901) id AA19088; Fri, 8 Jan 93 21:03:40 -0500 Received: by trigger.MorningStar.Com (5.65a/92122901) id AA03913; Fri, 8 Jan 93 21:03:38 -0500 Received: by david.roth-music.com (uA-1.5v4); Fri, 8 Jan 93 21:03:01 EST From: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) To: sgroup@lotus Subject: Roland R8 as MIDI module. Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1993 21:03:01 -0500 Organization: DAVID A. ROTH MUSIC Sender: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) Reply-To: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) Message-Id: <0105009A.n77451@david.roth-music.com> X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v4 Status: RO Forward of article <0105009A.n71ro1@david.roth-music.com> from david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth): Ok. Now I managed to get a hold of the ROM card I was looking for for the Roland R8 drum machine. It's the Dance one with the TR909 and the 303BASS, etc. Question: I know how to assign the 303BASS to play the different pitches via the pads in MULTI but how do I control this if I am using the R8 as a MIDI sound module? I am assuming (hoping) I get send a C3 and it will play that pitch for the 303BASS. Thanks in advance! David david@roth-music.com From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Mon Jan 11 14:03:41 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169200-3>; Mon, 11 Jan 1993 14:03:35 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Mon, 11 Jan 93 14:03:27 -0500 Received: from bcars520 ([192.58.194.73]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <43>; Mon, 11 Jan 1993 13:52:21 -0500 X400-Received: by mta bcars520 in /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Mon, 11 Jan 1993 13:49:42 -0500 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Mon, 11 Jan 1993 13:47:39 -0500 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Mon, 11 Jan 1993 08:47:00 -0500 Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1993 08:47:00 -0500 X400-Originator: /DD.ID=1577285/G=Shiv/I=S/S=Naimpally/@bnr.ca X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/;bcars520.b.998:11.00.93.18.47.39] X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2) Content-Identifier: re:Roland R8 ... From: "Shiv (S.) Naimpally" Message-Id: <"8038 Mon Jan 11 13:48:08 1993"@bnr.ca> To: david@roth-music.com Cc: sgroup@lotus Subject: re:Roland R8 as MIDI module. Status: R In message "Roland R8 as MIDI module.", david@roth-music.com writes: > Question: I know how to assign the 303BASS to play the different pitches > via the pads in MULTI but how do I control this if I am using the R8 > as a MIDI sound module? I am assuming (hoping) I get send a C3 and > it will play that pitch for the 303BASS. The R8 can chew gum and walk at the same time. The drum sounds are accessed on MIDI CH 10. You can pick 4 sounds and make them pitched so that they can be played on a keyboard. The default channels are MIDI CH 1-4. Note that these can be any sound, not just the bass and synth samples on the ROM cards. eg. I like to spread a crash cymbal across the keyboard for a full range of crashes. So you should be able to access drums sound on ch. 10 and the bass on one of ch. 1-4 (I think ch.1 is the default). At least thats how it works on my R8M ... Hope that helps. Shiv From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 14:42:08 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169631-3>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:41:59 -0500 Received: from att.att.com ([192.20.239.131]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <133>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:36:53 -0500 From: wbf@alux1.att.com Received: by alux1 (4.1/DCS-alux1-120392) id AA25299; Thu, 7 Jan 93 14:33:19 EST Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 14:33:19 -0500 Original-From: alux1!wbf (William Fox) Message-Id: <9301071933.AA25299@alux1> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Status: RO Subject: Re: stretching samples in S-family From: Flavio Bressan da Luz > The problem is: How to transfer samples if the old S family haven't > MIDI sample dump feature? From: Don Law > I got my S-10 (is that in the "old" S family?) to dump its sample to > MIDI using some key sequence that I found playing around. I couldn't > find it in the manual. I think it is something like press MIDI while > holding down F1. How does George keep our library? I beleive that I've seen him up- and download samples betweem his S50 and Mac. His software obviously must know what to send over the MIDI cable to tell his sampler to accept or send a sample. Bill Fox From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 7 16:56:37 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169690-3>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:56:28 -0500 Received: from usl.com ([147.2.200.17]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <139>; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:52:21 -0500 Date: Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:50:00 -0500 From: gfd@usl.com (George Demarest +1 908 522 6363) To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca, wbf@alux1.att.com Subject: sample editting Received: from usl by usl.com; Thu, 7 Jan 1993 16:50 EST Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1072 Message-Id: <93Jan7.165221est.139@lotus.uwaterloo.ca> Status: RO > Subject: Re: stretching samples in S-family > > From: Flavio Bressan da Luz > > The problem is: How to transfer samples if the old S family haven't > > MIDI sample dump feature? > > From: Don Law > > I got my S-10 (is that in the "old" S family?) to dump its sample to > > MIDI using some key sequence that I found playing around. I couldn't > > find it in the manual. I think it is something like press MIDI while > > holding down F1. > > How does George keep our library? I beleive that I've seen him up- and > download samples betweem his S50 and Mac. His software obviously must > know what to send over the MIDI cable to tell his sampler to accept or > send a sample. > > Bill Fox Sound Tools (and most sample editting software) sends SysEx to the sample that amounts to "send dump" over the midi cable. The computer then parses the data as it comes it and then resends it in a similar way when you wish to down load back to the sampler. No keypresses are required onthe sampler side although this may not be true for all sampler types. gfd From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 03:14:28 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169428-3>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 03:14:17 -0500 Received: from lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au ([137.154.156.3]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <49>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 03:11:10 -0500 Received: from arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au (arthur) by lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au with SMTP id AA23855 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Tue, 12 Jan 1993 19:10:17 +1100 Received: by arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au id AA06231 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Tue, 12 Jan 1993 19:10:07 +1100 From: Fluro Message-Id: <199301120810.AA06231@arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au> Subject: Hacker Mode on W30 To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 03:10:06 -0500 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL6] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 965 Status: R Hi, Well this is my first contribution to this group, I dont know if this has been discussed before, On the W30 there is a hacker mode (As roland call it) To use it press these keys in this order, USER USER & hold down the TEMPO and press F1 twice. I found this out when i got my scsi interface installed... One of the documents tell you how to get into this mode, Interestingly it says this document must be destroyed and the customer must not see this document.... Well i can partly see why, it is possible to crash the keyboard in hacker mode, and destroy some of the default patches, so use CAUTION.. It's interesting to play with never the less, especially the tone hack functions, this allows you to change all tone parameters, one thing i found useful was being able to assign tones greater then 32 to sample area A or B, or copy the ROM into RAM etc. To turn hacker mode off use the same key procedure as above, Have fun... Regards Matthew Parker From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 05:18:06 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168099-1>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 05:17:59 -0500 Received: from lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au ([137.154.156.3]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <27>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 05:07:19 -0500 Received: from arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au (arthur) by lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au with SMTP id AA24145 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:07:56 +1100 Received: by arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au id AA06632 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Tue, 12 Jan 1993 21:07:46 +1100 From: Fluro Message-Id: <199301121007.AA06632@arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au> Subject: Hacker Mode on W30 (fwd) To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 05:07:45 -0500 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL6] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1046 Status: R > > Hi, > Well this is my first contribution to this group, > I dont know if this has been discussed before, > On the W30 there is a hacker mode (As roland call it) > To use it press these keys in this order, USER USER > & hold down the TEMPO and press F1 twice. > I found this out when i got my scsi interface installed... > One of the documents tell you how to get into this mode, > Interestingly it says this document must be destroyed and > the customer must not see this document.... Well i can > partly see why, it is possible to crash the keyboard in hacker > mode, and destroy some of the default patches, so use CAUTION.. > It's interesting to play with never the less, especially the > tone hack functions, this allows you to change all tone > parameters, one thing i found useful was being able to assign tones > greater then 32 to sample area A or B, or copy the ROM into RAM etc. > > To turn hacker mode off use the same key procedure as above, > Have fun... > > Regards > Matthew Parker > > > PS I hope this makes it :) From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 06:36:28 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168382-2>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 06:36:18 -0500 Received: from ifi.uio.no ([129.240.64.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <29>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 06:33:13 -0500 Received: from [129.240.4.184] by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 12:32:56 +0100 Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 06:32:56 -0500 Message-Id: <199301121132.AAifi.uio.no01084@ifi.uio.no> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca From: Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no (Thomas Flemming) X-Sender: thomasfl@ifi.uio.no Subject: Re: Hacker Mode on W30 Status: R >It's interesting to play with never the less, especially the >tone hack functions, this allows you to change all tone >parameters, one thing i found useful was being able to assign tones >greater then 32 to sample area A or B, or copy the ROM into RAM etc. > Maybe it could be an idea to copy the whole of the ROM onto a disk so the owners of the other Roland samplers can use these samples. The sounds aren t good, but at least they have maanged to stack an awful lot of sound in there. >Regards > Matthew Parker BTW. I have finaly mailed an sgroove casette to Jon in Stockholm. Thomas Flemming From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 08:48:00 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168407-1>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 08:47:57 -0500 Received: from att.att.com ([192.20.239.131]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <72>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 08:41:31 -0500 From: wbf@alux1.att.com Received: by alux1 (4.1/DCS-alux1-120392) id AA18427; Tue, 12 Jan 93 08:36:31 EST Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 08:36:31 -0500 Original-From: alux1!wbf (William Fox) Message-Id: <9301121336.AA18427@alux1> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Status: R Subject: Archiving Important Facts I don't have a W30, but if I did, I'd hope to find data like Matthew Parker's posting about the hacker mode in our archives. Does anybody have the responsibility, or has anybody volunteered, to make sure gems like this get saved? (In the archive sense of saved, not the religious!) Bill Fox From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 09:34:17 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168420-3>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 09:34:08 -0500 Received: from watdragon.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.24]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <73>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 09:30:51 -0500 Received: by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca id <168417-1>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 09:30:28 -0500 From: "John M. Sellens" To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca, wbf@alux1.att.com Subject: sgroup archives .... Message-Id: <93Jan12.093028est.168417-1@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 09:30:20 -0500 Status: R | From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 08:48:00 1993 | From: wbf@alux1.att.com | Original-From: alux1!wbf (William Fox) | To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca | | Subject: Archiving Important Facts | | I don't have a W30, but if I did, I'd hope to find data like Matthew | Parker's posting about the hacker mode in our archives. Does anybody | have the responsibility, or has anybody volunteered, to make sure gems | like this get saved? (In the archive sense of saved, not the | religious!) | | Bill Fox | I save all messages that I see and make them available for FTP on a month-by-month basis and put them on lotus.uwaterloo.ca in pub/sgroup/archive. I don't separate out the exciting messages for easier access. John From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 14:58:49 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168794-1>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:58:44 -0500 Received: from andrew.cmu.edu ([128.2.10.101]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <87>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:51:57 -0500 Received: by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca; Tue, 12 Jan 93 14:51:28 EST Received: via switchmail; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:51:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from unix11.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:50:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from unix11.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:50:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mms.0.1.23.EzMail.2.0.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix11.andrew.cmu.edu.pmax.ul4 via MS.5.6.unix11.andrew.cmu.edu.pmax_ul4; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:50:18 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 14:50:18 -0500 From: Brian T Cheek To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: S770 Hacker Mode Status: R This is in response to the people who found a hacker mode on the W30. The S770 sampler has one as well. I personally don't know what they are. They don't tell you because supposedly you can permanently damage the machine if you do the wrong thing. Also in the S770 hacker mode is a version of Tetris. Maybe thats why they don't tell us the key combo. "Oh sir, believe me, this is the utmost in professional equipment." Yeah, well, Roland engineers are human too. -Brian :) From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 15:40:00 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168822-2>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:39:53 -0500 Received: from mailbox.syr.edu ([128.230.18.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <88>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:34:29 -0500 Received: from rodan.acs.syr.edu by mailbox.syr.edu (4.1/CNS) id AA22008; Tue, 12 Jan 93 15:34:53 EST Received: by rodan.acs.syr.edu (4.1/Spike-2.0) id AA02408; Tue, 12 Jan 93 15:33:16 EST Message-Id: <9301122033.AA02408@rodan.acs.syr.edu> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: S770 Hacker Mode In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jan 93 14:50:18 EST." Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 15:33:15 -0500 From: "neil herzinger" Status: R Brian T Cheek writes from CMU (home of the sgroup): >Also in the S770 hacker mode is a version of Tetris. Maybe thats why That is too much! I want to play on my S50! I guess I'll have to upgrade in order to get bells and whistles like that (makes for a good time killer inbetween sets or something.... :-) Lots o' mail on the sgroup (i've been off for a few weeks). Keep it up. I don't suppose there has been a major flood of sgroove contributions? gfd? h+? neil From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Tue Jan 12 17:19:13 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168856-1>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 17:19:07 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Tue, 12 Jan 93 17:19:04 -0500 Received: from ics.uci.edu ([128.195.1.1]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <90>; Tue, 12 Jan 1993 17:14:23 -0500 Received: from bonnie.ics.uci.edu by q2.ics.uci.edu id aa12952; 12 Jan 93 13:25 PST Received: from bonnie.ics.uci.edu by Bonnie.ics.uci.edu id aa23650; 12 Jan 93 13:25 PST Nto: neil herzinger Cc: sgroup@lotus To: Subject: Re: S770 Hacker Mode In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 12 Jan 93 15:33:15 -0500. <9301122033.AA02408@rodan.acs.syr.edu> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 16:25:27 -0500 From: Ciaran Foley Message-Id: <9301121325.aa23650@Bonnie.ics.uci.edu> Status: RO >Brian T Cheek writes from CMU (home of the sgroup): >>Also in the S770 hacker mode is a version of Tetris. Maybe thats why >That is too much! I want to play on my S50! I guess I'll have to upgrade in >order to get bells and whistles like that (makes for a good time killer >inbetween sets or something.... :-) Oooooh---that's why it costs $8000.00. I was wondering what I'd get for the money....;-) Ciaran From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 13 09:04:04 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168480-2>; Wed, 13 Jan 1993 09:04:02 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Wed, 13 Jan 93 09:03:48 -0500 Received: from volitans.MorningStar.Com ([137.175.2.11]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <32>; Wed, 13 Jan 1993 08:58:55 -0500 Received: from trigger.morningstar.com by volitans.MorningStar.Com (5.65a/92122901) id AA00856; Wed, 13 Jan 93 08:58:31 -0500 Received: by trigger.MorningStar.Com (5.65a/92122901) id AA16913; Wed, 13 Jan 93 08:58:26 -0500 Received: by david.roth-music.com (uA-1.5v4); Tue, 12 Jan 93 23:41:23 EST From: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) To: sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: S770 Hacker Mode Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1993 23:41:23 -0500 Organization: DAVID A. ROTH MUSIC Reply-To: david@roth-music.com (David A. Roth) Message-Id: <0105009A.ni1t2a@david.roth-music.com> X-Mailer: uAccess - Macintosh Release: 1.5v4 Status: R In Regards to your letter <9301122033.AA02408@rodan.acs.syr.edu>: > > Brian T Cheek writes from CMU (home of the sgroup): > > >Also in the S770 hacker mode is a version of Tetris. Maybe thats why > > That is too much! I want to play on my S50! I guess I'll have to upgrade in > order to get bells and whistles like that (makes for a good time killer > inbetween sets or something.... :-) For whatit's worth. If you dump an entire S-330 disk there is an ASCII string that says hacker mode. This was the first I heard about it a couple of years ago. I have not found out how to access it on the S-330 but if it can cause problems than as a user I am better off without it. :-) Then again, it might be a way to access an old style DDT debugger like on CP/M. Yeah, that's the ticket! Start writing your own code and turn the S-330 into a net news server! David david@roth-music.com From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Wed Jan 13 09:37:08 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168496-1>; Wed, 13 Jan 1993 09:36:59 -0500 Received: from kruuna.helsinki.fi ([128.214.4.112]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <33>; Wed, 13 Jan 1993 09:33:54 -0500 Received: from klaava.Helsinki.FI by kruuna.helsinki.fi with SMTP id AA11695 (5.65c8/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Wed, 13 Jan 1993 16:32:36 +0200 Received: by klaava.Helsinki.FI (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA20644; Wed, 13 Jan 93 16:32:35 +0200 From: tykkala@cc.helsinki.fi (Kimmo J. Tykkala) Message-Id: <9301131432.AA20644@klaava.Helsinki.FI> Subject: Hacker modes... To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 09:32:34 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 685 Status: R > > Then again, it might be a way to access an old style DDT debugger > like on CP/M. Yeah, that's the ticket! Start writing your own code > and turn the S-330 into a net news server! > > David > david@roth-music.com Yeah, but what's it's CPU??? Z-80? (At least it can't be anything faster than that... :-) ) Actually I'd like to know S-550:s CPU, but I think that's same than in S-330. Hmm... and how can I go to hacker mode in S-550, at least there is the "Hacker mode" text in S-550 operating system... -- > Kimmo J. Tykk{l{ > University of Helsinki > yks-kaks-kol-tekno > < tykkala@cc.helsinki.fi < Computing Centre < suurin melontanopeus < From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 13:52:59 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169597-2>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:52:49 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 14 Jan 93 13:52:37 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <41>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:48:32 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA17900; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 19:43:55 +0100 Received: from hemul.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA03576; Thu, 14 Jan 93 19:43:53 +0100 Received: by hemul.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA16662; Thu, 14 Jan 93 19:43:51 +0100 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:43:51 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301141843.AA16662@hemul.nada.kth.se> To: ARPRAYM@AC.DAL.CA, sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: GFD's Address Status: R > I sent a message to George earlier in the week about the SGroove. > I have me tape finished as per the agreement I had with George, > but I don't have his address. I'm sure it's located in the >From the SGroove "white paper": Submissions from US and Canada send in a SASE to: George Demarest 1165 Hillside Avenue Plainfield, NJ 07080 (908) 757-4655 (home) (908) 522-6363 (work) From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 13:52:59 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169596-2>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:52:48 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <41>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:48:32 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA17900; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 19:43:55 +0100 Received: from hemul.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA03576; Thu, 14 Jan 93 19:43:53 +0100 Received: by hemul.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA16662; Thu, 14 Jan 93 19:43:51 +0100 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:43:51 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301141843.AA16662@hemul.nada.kth.se> To: ARPRAYM@AC.DAL.CA, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: GFD's Address Status: R > I sent a message to George earlier in the week about the SGroove. > I have me tape finished as per the agreement I had with George, > but I don't have his address. I'm sure it's located in the >From the SGroove "white paper": Submissions from US and Canada send in a SASE to: George Demarest 1165 Hillside Avenue Plainfield, NJ 07080 (908) 757-4655 (home) (908) 522-6363 (work) From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Mon Jan 18 09:59:23 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168569-2>; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 09:59:19 -0500 Received: from usl.com ([147.2.200.17]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <41>; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 09:50:58 -0500 Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1993 09:47:00 -0500 From: gfd@usl.com (George Demarest +1 908 522 6363) To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: SGroove. Received: from usl by usl.com; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 09:47 EST Content-Type: text Content-Length: 449 Message-Id: <93Jan18.095058est.41@lotus.uwaterloo.ca> Status: R > > gfd? > Dunno, but he sounded positive. So far, I have but 2 tapes. I believe I have 2 others coming (Ray and Dave). I've had some maybes. The polls are closed at the end of this week. This is the FINAL warning. Come next Monday, I will have a DAT on it's way to Sweden. Happy New Year, y'all gfd > > h+? > > Mine + Terjes in. Another tape on its way from Norway, and > then I'll swap over the Atlantic. > > Cheers, > > / h+ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 23:01:45 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169785-3>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 23:01:41 -0500 Received: from lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au ([137.154.156.3]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <103>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 22:57:58 -0500 Received: from arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au (arthur) by lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au with SMTP id AA10399 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Fri, 15 Jan 1993 14:58:14 +1100 Received: by arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au id AA01793 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Fri, 15 Jan 1993 14:58:03 +1100 From: Fluro Message-Id: <199301150358.AA01793@arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au> Subject: Features of W30 Hacker Mode To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 22:58:03 -0500 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL6] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4904 Status: RO Forwarded message: > From Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no Thu Jan 14 12:51:33 1993 > Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 11:20:53 +0100 > Message-Id: <199301131020.AAifi.uio.no12172@ifi.uio.no> > To: Fluro > From: Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no (Thomas Flemming) > X-Sender: thomasfl@ifi.uio.no > Subject: Re: Hacker Mode on W30 > > I have tried hacker mode, and its fun with new functions > to play with. Do you know of any functions than tone hack, > and what migth destroy the keyboard? > > Have you tried to save and load disks with the tone settings > set in hacker-mode on the higher tones from 32 to 96? > > -Thomas Flemming > > I suppose alot of people are interested in what the Hacker mode has & does on the W30..... For people who own a W30 the easiest way to find out some of the new menus added is to go into the user menu (press user after Hacker mode is turn on), all the extra hacker menus start from menu 72 (thats with a FD/HD/CD system). The system disk version I have is 1.06. I will give a list of what is there : 72 Block Using : Gives a list of the sequencer memory used. 73 Block Tracer : I assume this is some debugging feature for tracing how blocks are linked together, I havent been interested enough to play with that yet. 74 Block Show : Show's what is contained in each sequencer block 75 Hacking tools : Does a no. of things..... 1) Welcome : shows the bootup message (welcome etc) 2) tone check : this checks to see that the tones are correct, ie when you assign a rom to a ram tone in the hacker mode this will go into error. 3) Chg System : Very Handing for resetting the keyboard. 4) Service : Is handy for checking out the hardware on the keyboard. This menu can check internal ram, all the keys, the controllers, after touch, pitch bender etc. And the last option reboot, doesnt seem to work. 5 Micro Edit : Shows some block info on the top, havent worked out what it is used for yet!! 76 Hack SCSI Check : Allows you to test the scsi chip, using a CD-Rom or Hard Disk or S-550 or another W-30. 49 Sound Disk Menu : Hack Save ROM 1 : This will save all 96 tone parameters and 16 patches onto your bootdisk. This can be used to redefine all your bootup patches. PLEASE NOTE : If you do play with this be sure to make up rom patches only, as the boot disk doesn't not store sample ram. Hack Save ROM 2 : This will do the same as Save ROM 1, except it will save all patches and tones in patches 17-32 on the boot disk. 41 Tone Parameter : Hack : has many options : 1) TSTONE : specifies the sub tone used for this tone, OSTONE has to be set for this to be used.. 2) OSTONE : 0 turns sub tones off. 1 turns sub tones on. 3) TSCLK : specifies the sampling rate. 0 : 30 khz sample 1 : 15 khz sample 4) TWBNK : specifies which ram/rom bank to use 0 : RAM bank A 1 : RAM bank B 2 : ROM back A 3 : ROM bank B 5) TSGTOP : Specifies were you sample starts in memory. EG 0 = start at 0 secs 1 = start at 0.4 secs 2 = start at 0.8 secs etc NOTE : This is assuming the sample is at 30khz. 6) TSGLEN : Specifies the length of the sample. EG 0 = no sample 1 = 0.4 sec sample 2 = 0.8 sec sample etc NOTE : You still have to set the loop points in the loop menu 42. Thats it, TSGTOP & TSGLEN are the two parameters that can possible crash the keyboard, HOW???? Well if you set TWBNK to RAM and set TSGTOP above 7.2 secs or make TSGLEN go longer then 7.2 secs (at 30khz) or you exceed the 7.2 sec limite that sample will be in the keyboards program area. Try it, by setting TSGTOP to 0 and TSGLEN to 16, ie a 512kw length, you will here your standard samples at the start then noise at the end, the noise is the program in memory, (may make a interested effect perhaps because it will always change when things load, only a thought). This doesnt actually crash the keyboard, but if you go to menu 56 (for example) and press DELETE and now delete that tone you created, the program will begin to delete all the sample area & then the program area, and hence the W30 will crash... That's one to crash it, i suppose there are others, and that is the main reason i see why Roland dont want to release the fact that there is a Hacker mode. This will not destroy your keyboard in anyway, its just a matter of turning the thing off and rebooting. As a final thing do take caution's, use a backuped disk, especailly if you are going to write new patches for the bootup, as you will loose your original default patches. Regards Matthew Parker From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 23:27:54 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169789-3>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 23:27:48 -0500 Received: from lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au ([137.154.156.3]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <105>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 23:24:06 -0500 Received: from arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au (arthur) by lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au with SMTP id AA10498 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Fri, 15 Jan 1993 15:24:21 +1100 Received: by arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au id AA02115 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Fri, 15 Jan 1993 15:24:11 +1100 From: Fluro Message-Id: <199301150424.AA02115@arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au> Subject: Modifing the W30 boot disk To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 23:24:10 -0500 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL6] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 754 Status: RO Hello again, Heres another neat trick for people with a W30...... If your lucky enough to own a IBM computer & are also lucky enough to own a sector editor (a program that can look at the physical sectors on a disk) you can then make your own personalised boot disk... All you need to do is make a copy of your boot disk, insert it in you 3 1/2 drive on you IBM compatible and fire up you sector editor.. Then simple go through each sector searching for text strings, ones like *Welcome* You can change these to read something completey different, like *Welcome* Matthew Parker to the W30, or change anything you like, i know this seems trivial, but its a bit of fun.... NOTE : a good sector editor is nortons disk editor... Regards Matthew Parker From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 15 04:46:42 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168004-3>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 04:46:38 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <43>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 04:43:42 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA10407; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 10:43:05 +0100 Received: from hemul.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA12691; Fri, 15 Jan 93 10:43:03 +0100 Received: by hemul.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA01336; Fri, 15 Jan 93 10:42:41 +0100 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1993 04:42:41 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301150942.AA01336@hemul.nada.kth.se> To: ESC@RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: S-750 vs. Other Samplers Status: RO > So, do I abandon the Roland samplers in favor of an Ensoniq ASR-10 rack > mount (about 1/2 the price of an S-750) and spend a week transferring my > samples from the S-330 or do I come up with the bucks for an S-750 and > ontinually pay the price for new samples, etc? I do like the video Well, I have an S-750 and it has never let me down. It has SCSI, 24 voice polyphony, resampling from performance (!) and video editting (it also has an LCD that you _can_ use in a pinch instead of the video) It is somewhat limited, in that it comes with 2 MB RAM and can only be expanded to 18MB, so in that regard the K2000 might be better (but then; I haven't seen its editting facilities) In my store, they had 15 SyQuest cartridges with sounds for the S-750 that I could copy, and also several CD ROMs for the S-550 (the 750 reads 550 CDs) The machine worked well enough with my old Mac CD player (a Toshiba) and SyQuest player (OEM-ed by APS) and I also have a small hard disk for it (Quantum) Cheersm / h+ -- -- Jon W{tte, h+@nada.kth.se, Mac Hacker Deluxe -- "Practice random kindness, and senseless acts of beauty." From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 15 09:44:33 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168215-3>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 09:44:25 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Fri, 15 Jan 93 09:44:21 -0500 Received: from RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM ([128.81.41.21]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <48>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 09:40:35 -0500 Received: from MOOG.SESC.SYMBOLICS.COM ([128.81.253.5]) by RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM via INTERNET with SMTP id 982644; 15 Jan 1993 09:41:17-0500 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1993 09:39:00 -0500 Illegal-Object: Syntax error in From: address found on lotus.uwaterloo.ca: From: Eric S.Crawley ^ ^-illegal period in phrase \-phrases containing '.' must be quoted Subject: Re: S-750 vs. Other Samplers From: To: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Cc: sgroup@lotus In-Reply-To: <9301150942.AA01336@hemul.nada.kth.se> Message-Id: <19930115143959.1.ESC@MOOG.SESC.Symbolics.COM> Status: RO Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1993 04:42 EST From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se > So, do I abandon the Roland samplers in favor of an Ensoniq ASR-10 rack > mount (about 1/2 the price of an S-750) and spend a week transferring my > samples from the S-330 or do I come up with the bucks for an S-750 and > ontinually pay the price for new samples, etc? I do like the video Well, I have an S-750 and it has never let me down. It has SCSI, 24 voice polyphony, resampling from performance (!) and video editting (it also has an LCD that you _can_ use in a pinch instead of the video) Right, most modern samplers have nearly that much polypony (the ASR has 21 voices, don't ask me how they come up with that number). The resampling option is also common now. Video editing isn't but more samplers have larger LCDs for displaying more than 2 lines. If you can get most of the information from the play and edit screens of the S-330, that is most of it. The waveform displays are nice but I don't use them too much and there are other ways to find loop points. It is somewhat limited, in that it comes with 2 MB RAM and can only be expanded to 18MB, so in that regard the K2000 might be better (but then; I haven't seen its editting facilities) I dunno, beyond 16MB or so, I don't know if I want to wait to load all of that up, even from CD. 24 MB sounds nice and I might even use all of that someday for flying in vocal parts, etc. but I think it might be a bit excessive initially. In my store, they had 15 SyQuest cartridges with sounds for the S-750 that I could copy, and also several CD ROMs for the S-550 (the 750 reads 550 CDs) The machine worked well enough with my old Mac CD player (a Toshiba) and SyQuest player (OEM-ed by APS) and I also have a small hard disk for it (Quantum) If I could find a store that did that out here, I would be very happy. When I bought my S-330 in the Boston area, there was a store that had a similar policy which allowed me to build up my library considerably. From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 15 09:59:52 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168224-1>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 09:59:48 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Fri, 15 Jan 93 09:59:42 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <49>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 09:55:39 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA04987; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 15:54:29 +0100 Received: from hemul.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA16939; Fri, 15 Jan 93 15:54:27 +0100 Received: by hemul.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA23613; Fri, 15 Jan 93 15:53:53 +0100 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1993 09:53:53 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301151453.AA23613@hemul.nada.kth.se> To: ESC@RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM, d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Subject: Re: S-750 vs. Other Samplers Cc: sgroup@lotus Status: RO > Right, most modern samplers have nearly that much polypony (the ASR has > 21 voices, don't ask me how they come up with that number). The Check the limitations for when it has 21 voices; I think it is not the "general case," but dependent on effects, sample rate or whatever. > samplers have larger LCDs for displaying more than 2 lines. If you can Well, the S-750 uses a LARGE LCD, but still scrolls it when you move the mouse :-) A video screen is a great help, at least to me. > I dunno, beyond 16MB or so, I don't know if I want to wait to load all > of that up, even from CD. 24 MB sounds nice and I might even use all of CD is dead slow. Even SyQuest is faster, and a decen HD is even better. However, here's my major gripe with Roland: THE FILE SYSTEM IS FUCKING UNBELIEAVABLY SLOW! It's like if ALL files were stored in a linked list. That, and the easy-to-make mistake of leaving the file "type" filter on can seriously affect the amount of work one can do with this. Oh, and while I'm at it, I would really like to be able to select several files at once and THEN press "delete" or "Load" or whatever - as it is now, I have to wait for each file to get at the next :-( Cheers, / h+ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 15 10:18:43 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168247-2>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 10:18:39 -0500 Received: from usl.com ([147.2.200.17]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <106>; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 10:15:46 -0500 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1993 10:13:00 -0500 From: gfd@usl.com (George Demarest +1 908 522 6363) To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: GFD's Address Received: from usl by usl.com; Fri, 15 Jan 1993 10:13 EST Content-Type: text Content-Length: 490 Message-Id: <93Jan15.101546est.106@lotus.uwaterloo.ca> Status: RO > > I sent a message to George earlier in the week about the SGroove. > > I have me tape finished as per the agreement I had with George, > > but I don't have his address. I'm sure it's located in the > > >From the SGroove "white paper": > > Submissions from US and Canada send in a SASE to: > > George Demarest > 1165 Hillside Avenue > Plainfield, NJ 07080 ^^^^^ well, almost: 07060 > (908) 757-4655 (home) > (908) 522-6363 (work) gfd From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 19:14:46 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169735-1>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 19:14:41 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 14 Jan 93 19:14:34 -0500 Received: from ics.uci.edu ([128.195.1.1]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <102>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 19:11:35 -0500 Received: from bonnie.ics.uci.edu by q2.ics.uci.edu id aa10825; 14 Jan 93 14:55 PST Received: from bonnie.ics.uci.edu by Bonnie.ics.uci.edu id aa01695; 14 Jan 93 14:54 PST To: ESC@RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM Cc: sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: S-750 vs. Other Samplers In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 14 Jan 93 16:38:00 -0500. <19930114213803.7.ESC@MOOG.SESC.Symbolics.COM> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 17:54:54 -0500 From: Ciaran Foley Message-Id: <9301141454.aa01695@Bonnie.ics.uci.edu> Status: RO >I have an S-330 (w/ mouse and monitor) and about 150 disks of samples. >I want to replace it with a sampler that has more memory (4 MB minimum >but with expansion capability), a SCSI interface (for hard disks and >CD-ROM), and stereo sampling. I was thinking of getting an S-750 but >So, do I abandon the Roland samplers in favor of an Ensoniq ASR-10 rack >mount (about 1/2 the price of an S-750) and spend a week transferring my >samples from the S-330 or do I come up with the bucks for an S-750 and ... >Are there other alternatives to >consider? There is an Akai dealer but >they don't stock any units and don't have any samples available. >Comments? Suggestions? Other criteria to consider? YES!!!!!! I'm a Roland fan, but recently acquired a Kurzweil K2000R, and quite frankly, Roland is going to have to do a lot to catch up to this beast for the price (please don't kick me off the mailing list--but what follows is definitely in favor of the K2000...sensitive viewers: discretion is advised).... First of all, lemme explain: the K2000 is NOT a SAMPLER. Well, not really anyway--but hang on... The following details regard the rackmount version: Standard, the K2000 comes with: 1) 2 SCSI ports built-in (CD-ROMS/HARD DRIVES etc) a) you can even hook up the K2000 directly to a mac for fast sample dump. b) uses standard mac hard drives/Cd rom's etc... 2) VAST architecture synthesis. INCREDIBLE array of some of the most elaborate synthesis algorithms and possibilities of ANY synthesizer ANYWHERE. 3) Ability to use Kurzweil and S1000 samples. Sample memory can be expanded to a whopping 64 MEGABYTES using standard Mac simms. 4) 8 megs internal ROM samples expandable to 24 megs!! 5) Ability to shape samples with SYNTHESIS algorithms (allowing flexibility that FAR SURPASSES most samplers) 6) 10 outs 7) VERY EASY TO PROGRAM/USE 8) High density disk drive (Ibm Compat format) Now, it gets better. Pretty soon (within the month, I think), Kurzweil is coming out with the sampling option for this beauty. USER-INSTALLABLE as is everything with it...at around $595, I've heard This will support: 1) upto 48khz sampling rate 2) 16 bit resolution 3) stereo sampling 4) I THINK...XLR inputs 5) digital INs and OUTs 6) RCA ins and outs 7) Sample memory (upto 64megabytes, remember) 8) software, from what I've heard will support on-screen digital editing...looping etc. As of yet, it doesn't support a mouse or extra screen. But boy it packs a wallup of support. 9) Ability to read (from what I've heard) AKAI S1000, KURZWEIL, and ROLAND S770(!) and ensoniq EPS DISKS!!!!!!! So not only do you have an advanced machine, but the incredible library of 4 COMPANIES and their respective 3rd party libraries. That's what I call a bargain. And the price? I picked the K2000 up for around $2000.00 The sampling option is less than $700 4 megs of simms (~$140) What do you think? Ciaran From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 13:17:28 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169161-2>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:17:23 -0500 Received: from ac.dal.ca ([129.173.1.100]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <38>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:11:02 -0500 Received: from AC.DAL.CA by AC.DAL.CA (PMDF #2545 ) id <01GTIFDFJ8KW004USW@AC.DAL.CA>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 14:08:44 -0400 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 13:08:44 -0500 From: Ray MacNeil Subject: GFD's Address To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Message-id: <01GTIFDFJ8KY004USW@AC.DAL.CA> X-VMS-To: IN%"sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Status: RO Guys and Gals... I sent a message to George earlier in the week about the SGroove. I have me tape finished as per the agreement I had with George, but I don't have his address. I'm sure it's located in the SGroup archives somewhere, but could someone provide this to me so I can get my tape to him? George... do you still want my tape? Ray MacNeil Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 15:50:03 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169649-1>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:50:01 -0500 Received: from andrew.cmu.edu ([128.2.10.101]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <91>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:45:39 -0500 Received: by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca; Thu, 14 Jan 93 15:44:39 EST Received: via switchmail; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:44:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from unix11.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:43:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from unix11.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:43:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mms.0.1.23.EzMail.2.0.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix11.andrew.cmu.edu.pmax.ul4 via MS.5.6.unix11.andrew.cmu.edu.pmax_ul4; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:43:32 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 15:43:32 -0500 From: Brian T Cheek To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: S770 uses a '186? AHH! Status: RO The S770 uses a 80C196? As in 80186, the quite abandoned chip by Intel for use in PC's? I'd hate to think processing 24 voices of 16 bit audio at 48kHz is running through a PC that runs close to 4.77 MHz! ...not that it matters, since everything works perfectly. -Brian :) PS. I personally thought the S770 was modeled around an Amiga computer, since the screen looks so much like an Amiga at 320x200 (I even have a personally created IFF picture to prove it!) Also the mouse looks the same as an Amiga mouse, but when I plugged it into my Amiga, it didn't quite work. Fun fun. From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 16:03:36 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169660-3>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 16:03:34 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 14 Jan 93 16:03:29 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <92>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 16:00:40 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA26377; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 22:00:25 +0100 Received: from dront.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA04975; Thu, 14 Jan 93 22:00:24 +0100 Received: by dront.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA14034; Thu, 14 Jan 93 22:00:11 +0100 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 16:00:11 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301142100.AA14034@dront.nada.kth.se> To: bc2y+@andrew.cmu.edu, sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: S770 uses a '186? AHH! Status: RO > I'd hate to think processing 24 voices of 16 bit audio at 48kHz is > running through a PC that runs close to 4.77 MHz! Real-time systems like this usually has an underpowered chip to handle slow things like user I/O, while the digital cream is provided by several custom DSPs, controlled by the slow chip. I opened my 750 up, and several of the larger chips have Rxxx codes on 'em and (c) Roland in lettering even granny can read :-) Now, does anyone know of an upgrade to put digital I/O on a S-750? Cheers, / h+ -- -- Jon W{tte, h+@nada.kth.se, Mac Hacker Deluxe -- Engineering: "How will this work?" Science: "Why will this work?" Management: "When will this work?" Liberal Arts: "Do you want fries with that?" -- Jesse N. Schell From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 17:15:20 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169694-3>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 17:15:10 -0500 Received: from RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM ([128.81.41.21]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <94>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 17:09:52 -0500 Received: from MOOG.SESC.SYMBOLICS.COM ([128.81.253.5]) by RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM via INTERNET with SMTP id 982379; 14 Jan 1993 16:39:22-0500 Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 16:38:00 -0500 Illegal-Object: Syntax error in From: address found on lotus.uwaterloo.ca: From: Eric S.Crawley ^ ^-illegal period in phrase \-phrases containing '.' must be quoted Subject: S-750 vs. Other Samplers From: To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Message-ID: <19930114213803.7.ESC@MOOG.SESC.Symbolics.COM> Status: RO I have an S-330 (w/ mouse and monitor) and about 150 disks of samples. I want to replace it with a sampler that has more memory (4 MB minimum but with expansion capability), a SCSI interface (for hard disks and CD-ROM), and stereo sampling. I was thinking of getting an S-750 but the price is a bit steep, especially when you look at what Roland wants for the new CD-ROMs. Access to samples is also very important. Most of the stores locally (southeast Michigan) deal with Ensoniq and have pretty good libraries that I can use for little or no additional cost. So, do I abandon the Roland samplers in favor of an Ensoniq ASR-10 rack mount (about 1/2 the price of an S-750) and spend a week transferring my samples from the S-330 or do I come up with the bucks for an S-750 and continually pay the price for new samples, etc? I do like the video output on the S-330 for editing samples, etc and I would miss that if I went to another sampler that didn't have decent editing facilities. Are there other alternatives to consider? There is an Akai dealer but they don't stock any units and don't have any samples available. Comments? Suggestions? Other criteria to consider? From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 14 09:04:35 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168563-1>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 09:04:28 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 14 Jan 93 09:04:20 -0500 Received: from lambda.msfc.nasa.gov ([128.158.1.223]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <35>; Thu, 14 Jan 1993 09:00:01 -0500 Received: by lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (4.1/SMI-4.0) id AA25340; Thu, 14 Jan 93 07:59:42 CST Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1993 08:59:42 -0500 From: cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (David Cornutt) Message-Id: <9301141359.AA25340@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov> To: sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: Hacker modes... Status: RO > Actually I'd like to know S-550:s CPU, but I think that's same > than in S-330. Hmm... and how can I go to hacker mode in S-550, > at least there is the "Hacker mode" text in S-550 operating > system... Don't know about the 550, but the 750/770 uses an 80186. (Actually, according to the number on the chip in my 750, it's an "80C196", which I assume is a CMOS version of the 80186, maybe with some extra interrupt pins or something.) And yes, it is an Intel part. From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Mon Jan 18 15:42:33 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168957-2>; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 15:42:23 -0500 Received: from bcars520 ([192.58.194.73]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <87>; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 15:37:52 -0500 X400-Received: by mta bcars520 in /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 15:34:55 -0500 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 15:33:34 -0500 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Mon, 18 Jan 1993 10:29:00 -0500 Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1993 10:29:00 -0500 X400-Originator: /DD.ID=1577285/G=Shiv/I=S/S=Naimpally/@bnr.ca X400-MTS-Identifier: [/PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/;bcars520.b.732:18.00.93.20.33.34] X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2) Content-Identifier: re:S-750 vs. ... From: "Shiv (S.) Naimpally" Message-ID: <"7772 Mon Jan 18 15:34:05 1993"@bnr.ca> To: ESC@RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM Cc: "Matt (M.) Cohen" , sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: re:S-750 vs. Other Samplers Status: R In message "S-750 vs. Other Samplers", ESC@RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.com writes: > I have an S-330 (w/ mouse and monitor) and about 150 disks of samples. > I want to replace it with a sampler that has more memory (4 MB minimum > but with expansion capability), a SCSI interface (for hard disks and > CD-ROM), and stereo sampling. I was thinking of getting an S-750 but > the price is a bit steep, I am in the same boat. I am tired of disk swapping and want SCSI for my S330. Unfortunately it appears no one makes a SCSI upgrade for it. I looked at Ensoniq's stuff but even their new ASR-10 can be expanded only to 8M I think. > Are there other alternatives to consider? There is an Akai dealer but > they don't stock any units and don't have any samples available. > Comments? Suggestions? Other criteria to consider? I am seriously thinking of getting the Kurzweill K2000. The sampling option is now available. The processing architecture is excellent. One of the best things about the K2000 is the access to samples. It will read Kurzweill K250 sample disks (naturally), Akai S1000 disks, and the latest operating system (2.0) allows it to read Ensoniq and Roland disks ! I am trying to confirm the part about Roland disks and to make sure S330/S50 format disks are included. It has 24 part polyphony with 4 osc per voice, SCSI, optional digital I/O AES/EBU ports, and is expandable to 64M bytes using standard Mac SIMMs. Sweetwater Sound in Fort Wayne Indiana sells and supports the Kurzweill ... If you buy an Ensoniq you will likely to have to buy a computer based ed/lib such as Sound Designer, send your samples to it, store them and convert them and then ship them to your target sampler. From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 21 00:05:42 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169472-1>; Thu, 21 Jan 1993 00:05:40 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Thu, 21 Jan 93 00:05:29 -0500 Received: from world.std.com ([192.74.137.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <27>; Wed, 20 Jan 1993 23:59:01 -0500 Received: by world.std.com (5.65c/Spike-2.0) id AA22556; Wed, 20 Jan 1993 23:54:47 -0500 Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1993 23:51:21 -0500 From: michael gary moncur Subject: S330 filtering/effects To: SGroup Post Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: R Possibly a silly question. Has anyone ever gotten any useful use out of the "filter" programs on the S-330? I haven't been able to get them to do much besides ruin samples, although I did clean up a noisy voiceover once. Related question, are there any creative effects you've discovered? I'm looking for ways to spice up and/or change drum sounds, mainly snares. Anything ranging from minor touch-ups to nasty overdrive effects would be nifty. ~`~`michael moncur - mgm@world.std.com / sysop@onlybbs.via.mind.org ~`~` From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Thu Jan 21 12:02:04 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169518-2>; Thu, 21 Jan 1993 12:01:59 -0500 Received: from lambda.msfc.nasa.gov ([128.158.1.223]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <30>; Thu, 21 Jan 1993 11:57:40 -0500 Received: from mango (mango.msfc.nasa.gov) by lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (4.1/SMI-4.0) id AA27428; Thu, 21 Jan 93 10:56:53 CST Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1993 11:56:53 -0500 From: cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (David Cornutt) Message-Id: <9301211656.AA27428@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: S330 filtering/effects Status: R >From sgroup-owner@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Wed Jan 20 23:11:50 1993 Return-Path: Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by lambda.msfc.nasa.gov (4.1/SMI-4.0) id AA03363; Wed, 20 Jan 93 23:11:28 CST Received: from world.std.com ([192.74.137.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <27>; Wed, 20 Jan 1993 23:59:01 -0500 Received: by world.std.com (5.65c/Spike-2.0) id AA22556; Wed, 20 Jan 1993 23:54:47 -0500 Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1993 23:51:21 -0500 From: michael gary moncur Subject: S330 filtering/effects To: SGroup Post Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Status: R >Possibly a silly question. Has anyone ever gotten any useful use out of >the "filter" programs on the S-330? I haven't been able to get them to do >much besides ruin samples, although I did clean up a noisy voiceover once. The S750 has a filter program too, and I don't think too much of it. It's got three major problems: (1) It isn't possible to set the filter bandwidth or Q, or the number of (simulated) poles. (There is a "resonance" parameter, but it doesn't really do what I want, because it effects both bandwidth and depth. I want to control them separately, like a parametric EQ.) (2) For some inane reason, you have to give the cutoff frequency in arbitrary units on a 0-10 scale. This means intermitable cycles of "guess the cutoff frequency, try it, listen to it, undo it, guess a new cutoff frequency...", until you want to scream. It's nearly always easier to either use the real-time TVF, or, if that isn't an option, pipe it out to tape, run it through my Furman parametric EQ, and resample it. It would be so much easier if you could specify the cutoff frequency in Hz. (3) The damn thing nearly *always* complains about a level overflow for any non-trivial setting of cutoff and resonance, even with the level parameter set to the minimum value that produces any sound at all. This seems to bear no correlation to whether or not any clipping actually occurred during the computation. > Related question, are there any creative effects you've discovered? I'm >looking for ways to spice up and/or change drum sounds, mainly snares. >Anything ranging from minor touch-ups to nasty overdrive effects would be >nifty. I don't know what the S-330 has, but you would be surprised what you can do with snare and cymbal sounds just by truncating the ends and/or chopping them into pieces. I've improved several snare sounds by just cutting off all the words up to the top of the spike for the initial hit; this puts a very high slope on the initial spike and really makes the sample pop. (For an interesting erzatz snare, sample a burst of white noise. Then, truncate the beginning so that the first word in the sample has a very high value, which will put a "snap" on the beginning of the sample. And, if you run the noise through a reverb when you sample it, and then chop off the reverb "tail", you can get a gated-reverb effect superior to any effects box.) Can the S-330 compute a ring modulation? *There's* a cool effect. :-) David Cornutt, New Technology Inc., Huntsville, AL (205) 461-4517 (cornutt@lambda.msfc.nasa.gov; some insane route applies) "The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my employer, not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary." From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 22 02:12:35 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169817-2>; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 02:12:24 -0500 Received: from lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au ([137.154.156.3]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <53>; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 02:08:14 -0500 Received: from arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au (arthur) by lancelot.st.nepean.uws.edu.au with SMTP id AA10112 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Fri, 22 Jan 1993 18:08:40 +1100 Received: by arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au id AA06464 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca); Fri, 22 Jan 1993 18:08:28 +1100 From: Fluro Message-Id: <199301220708.AA06464@arthur.st.nepean.uws.edu.au> Subject: w30 hacker mode details To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 02:08:27 -0500 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL6] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 5502 Status: R > To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca I seem to be having some problem sending to the above address it refuses to mail, anyway here it goes again. My apoligies if you have received this twice, if you have let me know, then i at least know this mail is making it to the group. Anyway here it goes again... > Forwarded message: > > From Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no Thu Jan 14 12:51:33 1993 > > Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1993 11:20:53 +0100 > > Message-Id: <199301131020.AAifi.uio.no12172@ifi.uio.no> > > To: Fluro > > From: Thomas.Flemming@usit.uio.no (Thomas Flemming) > > X-Sender: thomasfl@ifi.uio.no > > Subject: Re: Hacker Mode on W30 > > > > I have tried hacker mode, and its fun with new functions > > to play with. Do you know of any functions than tone hack, > > and what migth destroy the keyboard? > > > > Have you tried to save and load disks with the tone settings > > set in hacker-mode on the higher tones from 32 to 96? > > > > Yes they work correctly when loading & saving.. > > > -Thomas Flemming > > > > > I suppose alot of people are interested in what the Hacker mode has > & does on the W30..... > For people who own a W30 the easiest way to find out some of the new > menus added is to go into the user menu (press user after Hacker mode > is turn on), all the extra hacker menus start from menu 72 (thats with > a FD/HD/CD system). The system disk version I have is 1.06. > I will give a list of what is there : > > 72 Block Using : Gives a list of the sequencer memory used. > > 73 Block Tracer : I assume this is some debugging feature for tracing > how blocks are linked together, I havent been > interested enough to play with that yet. > > 74 Block Show : Show's what is contained in each sequencer block > > 75 Hacking tools : Does a no. of things..... > 1) Welcome : shows the bootup message (welcome etc) > 2) tone check : this checks to see that the tones > are correct, ie when you assign a rom to a ram tone > in the hacker mode this will go into error. > 3) Chg System : Very Handing for resetting the > keyboard. > 4) Service : Is handy for checking out the > hardware on the keyboard. > This menu can check internal ram, all the keys, > the controllers, after touch, pitch bender etc. > And the last option reboot, doesnt seem to work. > > 5 Micro Edit : Shows some block info on the top, havent worked out > what it is used for yet!! > > 76 Hack SCSI Check : Allows you to test the scsi chip, using a > CD-Rom or Hard Disk or S-550 or another W-30. > > 49 Sound Disk Menu : Hack Save ROM 1 : This will save all 96 tone > parameters and 16 patches onto your bootdisk. > This can be used to redefine all your bootup > patches. PLEASE NOTE : If you do play with this > be sure to make up rom patches only, as the > boot disk doesn't not store sample ram. > Hack Save ROM 2 : This will do the same as Save > ROM 1, except it will save all patches and tones > in patches 17-32 on the boot disk. > > 41 Tone Parameter : Hack : has many options : > 1) TSTONE : specifies the sub tone used for this > tone, OSTONE has to be set for this to be used.. > 2) OSTONE : 0 turns sub tones off. > 1 turns sub tones on. > 3) TSCLK : specifies the sampling rate. > 0 : 30 khz sample > 1 : 15 khz sample > 4) TWBNK : specifies which ram/rom bank to use > 0 : RAM bank A > 1 : RAM bank B > 2 : ROM back A > 3 : ROM bank B > 5) TSGTOP : Specifies were you sample starts in > memory. > EG 0 = start at 0 secs > 1 = start at 0.4 secs > 2 = start at 0.8 secs > etc > NOTE : This is assuming the sample > is at 30khz. > 6) TSGLEN : Specifies the length of the sample. > EG 0 = no sample > 1 = 0.4 sec sample > 2 = 0.8 sec sample > etc > NOTE : You still have to set the > loop points in the loop menu 42. > > Thats it, TSGTOP & TSGLEN are the two parameters that can possible > crash the keyboard, HOW???? > Well if you set TWBNK to RAM and set TSGTOP above 7.2 secs or make > TSGLEN go longer then 7.2 secs (at 30khz) or you exceed the 7.2 sec > limite that sample will be in the keyboards program area. Try it, > by setting TSGTOP to 0 and TSGLEN to 16, ie a 512kw length, you will > here your standard samples at the start then noise at the end, the > noise is the program in memory, (may make a interested effect perhaps > because it will always change when things load, only a thought). This > doesnt actually crash the keyboard, but if you go to menu 56 (for > example) and press DELETE and now delete that tone you created, the > program will begin to delete all the sample area & then the program > area, and hence the W30 will crash... > > That's one to crash it, i suppose there are others, and that is the > main reason i see why Roland dont want to release the fact that there > is a Hacker mode. This will not destroy your keyboard in anyway, its > just a matter of turning the thing off and rebooting. > > As a final thing do take caution's, use a backuped disk, especailly > if you are going to write new patches for the bootup, as you will > loose your original default patches. > > Regards > Matthew Parker > > From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Sat Jan 23 08:14:14 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168364-3>; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 08:14:11 -0500 Received: from ifi.uio.no ([129.240.64.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <41>; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 08:09:57 -0500 Received: from haarbard.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 14:08:19 +0100 From: Thomas Flemming Received: by haarbard.ifi.uio.no ; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 14:08:17 +0100 Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 08:08:17 -0500 Message-Id: <9301231308.AAhaarbard.ifi.uio.no26527@haarbard.ifi.uio.no> To: shiv@bnr.ca Cc: mgm@world.std.com, mcohen@bnr.ca, sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca In-Reply-To: "Shiv (S.) Naimpally"'s message of Fri, 22 Jan 1993 11:25:00 -0500 <"9268 Fri Jan 22 16:28:22 1993"@bnr.ca> Subject: Re: re:S330 filtering/effects Status: R > I use the filter to filter out that nasty high pitched sound that comes > in at the end of a user sample. If the filter envelope is is not being > swept (ie. it is static) during the sustained portion, you can brighten > the sound by increasing the resonance. The filter resonance is thin and > nasally so I rarely use it for anything else. To avoid nasty high pitch sound at the end of samples, try truncating the sample so you get a few zero-bytes after the sample. Then go in the loop window and move the end point to one of the zero-bytes. Good old trick, that one! I use the filter at maximum effect to get bass sounds sound like muddy analog bass. With the resonance at about 50, the cut-off at 10 and a envelope-curve that cuts the bass very fast. On my W-30 I often use the juno-rez ROM tone as a basis for adjusting the filter. -Thomas Flemming From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Sat Jan 23 14:42:23 1993 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.9]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169185-2>; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 14:42:17 -0500 Received: from mailbox.syr.edu ([128.230.18.5]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <57>; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 14:37:47 -0500 Received: from rodan.acs.syr.EDU by mailbox.syr.edu (4.1/CNS) id AA04966; Sat, 23 Jan 93 14:38:44 EST Received: by rodan.acs.syr.EDU (4.1/Spike-2.0) id AA03701; Sat, 23 Jan 93 14:38:39 EST Message-Id: <9301231938.AA03701@rodan.acs.syr.EDU> To: sgroup@lotus.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: S330 filtering/effects In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 23 Jan 93 08:08:17 EST." <9301231308.AAhaarbard.ifi.uio.no26527@haarbard.ifi.uio.no> Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 14:38:39 -0500 From: "neil herzinger" Status: R So what is it with that high-pitched sound at the end of samples when you truncate them? I've never really understood why that happens. The only way I've gotten around it is to move the end point a few bits at a time until the sound disapears. I'll have to try your method next time Thomas... neil From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Sat Jan 23 18:32:11 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169223-3>; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 18:32:07 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Sat, 23 Jan 93 18:31:58 -0500 Received: from sunic.sunet.se ([192.36.125.2]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <72>; Sat, 23 Jan 1993 18:27:57 -0500 Received: from nada.kth.se (mail.nada.kth.se) by sunic.sunet.se (5.65c8/1.28) id AA12683; Sun, 24 Jan 1993 00:27:32 +0100 Received: from cyklop.nada.kth.se by nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA16389; Sun, 24 Jan 93 00:27:30 +0100 Received: by cyklop.nada.kth.se (5.61-bind 1.4+ida/nada-mx-1.0) id AA11796; Sun, 24 Jan 93 00:27:24 +0100 Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1993 18:27:24 -0500 From: d88-jwa@nada.kth.se Message-Id: <9301232327.AA11796@cyklop.nada.kth.se> To: naherzin@mailbox.syr.edu, sgroup@lotus Subject: Re: S330 filtering/effects Status: R > So what is it with that high-pitched sound at the end of samples when you > truncate them? I've never really understood why that happens. The only It's the transient when the sample goes from an extremum to 0 in 1 sample (or even when you halt a going wave too fast, even if it's on a zero crossing) The traditional "fix" is to add 1/100th of a second of fade-out at the end, and truncate when it's really down at 0. Cheers, / h+ From lotus.uwaterloo.ca!sgroup-owner Fri Jan 22 16:36:32 1993 Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca ([129.97.140.144]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <169060-3>; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:36:26 -0500 Received: from lotus.uwaterloo.ca by math.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id ; Fri, 22 Jan 93 16:36:21 -0500 Received: from bcars520 ([192.58.194.73]) by lotus.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <38>; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:31:25 -0500 X400-Received: by mta bcars520 in /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:28:55 -0500 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 16:27:22 -0500 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Fri, 22 Jan 1993 11:25:00 -0500 Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1993 11:25:00 -0500 X400-Originator: /DD.ID=1577285/G=Shiv/I=S/S=Naimpally/@bnr.ca X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/;bcars520.b.187:22.00.93.21.27.22] X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2) Content-Identifier: re:S330 filte... From: "Shiv (S.) Naimpally" Message-Id: <"9268 Fri Jan 22 16:28:22 1993"@bnr.ca> To: mgm@world.std.com Cc: "Matt (M.) Cohen" , sgroup@lotus Subject: re:S330 filtering/effects Status: RO In message "S330 filtering/effects", mgm@world.std.com writes: > > Possibly a silly question. Has anyone ever gotten any useful use out of > the "filter" programs on the S-330? I haven't been able to get them to do > much besides ruin samples, although I did clean up a noisy voiceover once. I use the filter to filter out that nasty high pitched sound that comes in at the end of a user sample. If the filter envelope is is not being swept (ie. it is static) during the sustained portion, you can brighten the sound by increasing the resonance. The filter resonance is thin and nasally so I rarely use it for anything else.