From mailbox.syr.edu!naherzin Sat Oct 31 22:04:45 1992 Received: from mailbox.syr.edu ([128.230.18.5]) by watdragon.uwaterloo.ca with SMTP id <168430-2>; Sat, 31 Oct 1992 22:04:38 -0500 Received: from rodan.acs.syr.edu by mailbox.syr.edu (4.1/CNS) id AA11093; Sat, 31 Oct 92 22:05:26 EST Received: by rodan.acs.syr.edu (4.1/Spike-2.0) id AA05875; Sat, 31 Oct 92 22:00:40 EST Message-Id: <9211010300.AA05875@rodan.acs.syr.edu> To: jmsellen@watdragon.uwaterloo.ca Subject: 1991 July Date: Sat, 31 Oct 1992 22:00:39 -0500 From: "neil herzinger" Status: R >From: gfd@mtdca.att.com >From: g.f.demarest@mtdca.att.com To: att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+@mtdca.att.com Date: 10 Jul 1991 9:18 EDT Subject: Stuff >From: Ray MacNeil > George, > > I was talking to Neil recently and he suggested that I drop you a line > *before* I sample anything and send it to you. That's why Neil will always get a Christmas card from me... (next time Neil) > I have read the "Rules '91", and think I have most of what you want figured > out. I have an S-550, and am already a member of the group, just not an > active one. I recently bought the S-500, (and sold an S-10), and will now > become a more active member of the group. ok > One thing I was asking Neil about was whether it was generally accepted > that you should send in samples before you request any from the group. Is > this generally the way you want it done? You could do this, I suppose. But while I have your disks, why don't you just get some stuff from the group anyway. There's a good sized list by now and a lot of the stuff is quite good. At worst you could erase the disks if you didn't like them. > Anything else I need to know? > Another thing I was asking was instead of using the mail to send samples, > why can't we sysex them from the sampler, into a standard MIDI file, and > then binHex them to you? I, personally am no in the position to be shipping large files over the network from my location. If someone were to get server happening someday, that would be fine. Until then, it's snail mail. Also, folks from other countries should send return postage in US dollars. gfd > Ray MacNeil > Halifax, Nova Scotia > Canada -- To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Ultimate Sample Organizer Date: 14 Jul 91 01:43:42 EDT (Sun) >From: david!david@cis.ohio-state.edu (David A. Roth) Hi Gang! If you recall we were talking about using something like a Hypercard program to create a sample organizer. I came across this on my MAC that I download from PAN a while ago but didn't get a chance to check it out because I don't have Filemaker. In any event, here is the "Manual" for the Disk Labeler. Since the author has accounts on PAN and Compuserv I sent the author e-mail offering them to be added to the sgroup mailing list if they wish and if there has been any improvements made to the Disk Labeler or methods. As you can read at the end of the manual it is based on an article published in the Feb/89 issue of EM. Anyone know what Filemaker costs? Some want to take a stab at creating this as a Hypercard program? If someone is interested in I have the back issue published in EM which I could postal mail a photocopy of it to the would-be Hypercard programmer. David osu-cis!david!david uunet!abvax!osu-cis!david!david =======================CUT HERE============================== ** Disk Labeler - (Filemaker II Template) Version 1.0 ** February 27, 1989 Cyrus Fenton HUMMINGBIRD - PAN 76056,1757 - Compuserve (615) 298-5096 Comments/Criticism are welcome and wanted. GENERAL: The purpose of this template is to organize and keep track of the multitude of 3 1/2" floppy disks that are the blessing and the curse of Mac enthusiasts, musicians and many others. This template requires Filemaker II by Claris (or Filemaker IV by Nashoba - they are the same program), a Macintosh computer, and an Imagewriter II. It uses regular 8 1/2 x 11 paper for the report print outs and it uses tractor-feed disk labels (2 3/4 x 2 3/4) available inexpensively from Budgetbytes (or other forms suppliers.) These instructions will assume that the user is familiar with the Filemaker II program. FIELDS: The fields are the following: DISK NAME DISK CONTENTS 1-8 DISK CONTENTS 9-16 MACHINE TYPE PRINTED? DISK FAMILY DISK TYPE DISK NUMBER FAMILY NUMBER DISK DESCRIPTION "Disk Name" is fairly obvious. It is the name of your disk. If you have no name, then don't worry about it (though with large libraries, it's easier to remember individual disks if they are named). I broke "Disk Contents" fields up into two parts primarily because the Roland S-550 breaks it up that way. If you don't want it to be broken up, just get rid of the "9-16" and pull the "1-8" field over to replace it. The lines on the disk label will stay in place. "Machine Type" tells you which machine the disk goes to (Mac Computer, Roland S550, Akai S900, EMAX, etc). Currently, it is automatically entering "Roland S-550", but you can change this easily by using the "Entry Options" section of the "Define" option under the "Select" menu in Filemaker. "Printed? " is usually used as a Find field. I use it to seperate the newly entered disks from the older ones that have been printed. This field is automatically entering "No", because any new record is probably not been printed. Again, this can be easily changed by you if necessary. After I have printed all my labels, I do a global replace (command "=") and replace all the "Printed?" fields with "yes". This way, I can find all my previously entered (and labeled) disks and leave them out of the next print batch. "Disk Family" automatically brings up a list that includes: Brass Woodwinds Strings Keyboards Percussion Tuned Percussion Combination SFX Most of these are self explanitory. Combination is a designation for any disks that have a variety of samples on them. I use the "Disk Family" field to specify the large groups that the samples fall into. This field might be less useful for labeling things other than samplers. It also is one part of the calculation field "Family Number." All lists are defined in the "Entry Options" section of the "Define" option under the "Select" menu. The "Disk Family" list is easily customized by you for your setup, or it can be turned completely off. It's best, however, to leave the list on, for it provides you with a list of consistant "keywords" that you will need if you want to do any sorting or finding. "Disk Type" automatically brings up a list that includes: Orchestral Acoustic Pop Ethnic Synth Electric Funky Ethereal Bass Outdoors Weird These are strictly only what I use to break down my large groups of samples. You can use whatever scheme you choose, and you can change or turn off the list as is described under "Disk Family." Again, it is best to the leave the list on, so you can have a consistant list of "keywords" for when you do your sorts and finds. If you find that you are often using a keyword that is not on the list, do yourself a favor and add it to the list. "Disk Number" and "Family Number" go hand in hand. The reason for having both the numbers (and apparent redundancy) was that I wanted to be able to number (and store) my disks by family, and be able to slot in new disks without completely disturbing the existing numbering system. The way I did this was to give each disk a number that corresponded to its family. If there are 10 disks in the "Brass" family, then I would number them 1-10. If there are 8 disks in the "Keyboard" family, then I would number them 1-8, etc. I then created a calculation field that would take the first three letters of the family and combine them with the "Disk Number" to create the "Family Number." So, our "Brass" family disks would be named BRA001, BRA002, etc. and our "Keyboard" family disks would be named KEY001, KEY002, etc. For me, this system has proved to be very successful. When I go to number the disks, I just sort by "Disk Family" first, then by "Disk Number". Then I can give any new disks the the next consectutive number. One prolem with Filemaker is that it doesn't allow you to format a number with zeros in front of it. For example, if you type "001", it will give you back "1". I really wanted the zeros, so for all my numbers, I type "10xx", xx being the number of the disk. I have set the calculation field up to read only the first 3 numbers from the right. The result is that when I type "1001" into the "Disk Number" field, the "Family Number" field picks up "001", hence the zero problem is solved. If you want to change this format of numbering, and you are having trouble manipulating the text calculation fields, leave me a note on PAN, or CIS, or call me at home, and I will try to help you with it. Also, if anyone has a more eloquent solution to these problems, please send me a note as to your ideas. LAYOUTS: The template is divided up into 5 layouts, accessible through the scripts menu or manually in the layout mode. The first layout is a long form that provides access to all fields. The second layout is a short form that is primarily for speedy data entry. The third and fourth layouts are intended for viewing the entire library in list form. The fifth layout is the label layout. The first layout includes fields for disk name, rating, family and type, disk number and family number, machine type, a sorting field called "printed?", disk contents, and a comments section. The second layout duplicates the first, but has no comments section. The third layout has only the disk name, type, and family, the disk number, the family number, and the rating. This layout is useful for creating lists of your disk library. The fourth layout is a columnar layout that includes the disk name and type, the family number, the rating and the machine type. This will provide you a list of all your disks for your reference. PRINTING: The last little bit here is on printing the labels. Be prepared to use a few labels getting the alignment right. Filemaker will not print on the first label before you have started a print job. I don't know why, but it won't. I usually line up the labels 1/4 to 1/2 inches to the right (as you are looking at the top of the machine) of the paper mark on the back of the Imagewriter II. I start with the left hand tractor slid as far to the right as it will go (only about 3/4 of an inch). After that, I feed the labels in and I put the leading edge (the top) of the first one in line with the print head. This should not foul the printer, as Filemaker ejects this label anyway. Then I adjust it and print, adjust and print, until I get it the way I want it. Remember to only print the current record for your tests. The program prints the label so the disks are sitting shutters down. It prints the "Machine Type" on the back of the disk. It prints the "Disk Name" and the "Family Number" on the top spine of the disk. It prints the "Disk Name", "Family Number", "Disk Contents", "Machine Type" and "Disk Type" on the front of the label. It will print library listings. It will print full reports on each disk, including all information (with or without comments). You can sort by family, type, and rating. By using both the Find and Sort features, you can pull out only the Orchestral Keyboard (or others) samples, or only the Orchestral type samples, regardless of the family. The one thing that this database does not do well is deal with the individual samples. Look for something upcoming in about a month or two that will deal with the sounds themselves and will (hopefully) interface with this template. I know that I haven't covered all there is to cover in this little manual, but hopefully it will get you going and able to use this template that I have found so helpful. Any comments and/or suggestions are very welcome! BTW - If the family and type lists look familiar, I must admit that I took them straight out of Craig Anderton's article on sampling in the February 1989 Electronic Musician (the one with the hummingbird on it!). In fact, that's where this whole idea came from! Thanks Craig! Happy Disk Labeling! CY -- Date: Sun, 14 Jul 91 10:48:59 -0400 (EDT) >From: Neil Anthony Herzinger To: Sgroup Subject: Re: Ultimate Sample Organizer Sounds pretty interesting. I don't have filemaker either, so I couldn't use it. My MacWarehose catalog lists Filemaker Pro for $218. My own interests in the program are for database storage only, not printing. I don't know how others feel about this though. I would be willing to set up a hypercard program with similar parameters if no one else wants to. I can do simple scripting and page layout stuff, it doesn't look like it will be very difficult. I wouldn't incorporate a printing function though, as I wouldn't know how to go about doing that. Any other comments? neil -- To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: Ultimate Sample Organizer Date: 14 Jul 91 21:34:58 EDT (Sun) >From: david!david@cis.ohio-state.edu (David A. Roth) >From uucp Sun Jul 14 21:14 EDT 1991 >>From andrew.cmu.edu!nh0n+ Sun Jul 14 21:14:32 1991 remote from osu-cis >Message-Id: >Date: Sun, 14 Jul 91 10:48:59 -0400 (EDT) >From: Neil Anthony Herzinger >To: Sgroup >Subject: Re: Ultimate Sample Organizer > >[...] >My own interests in the program are for database storage only, not printing. I >don't know how others feel about this though. I would be willing to set up a >hypercard program with similar parameters if no one else wants to. I can do >simple scripting and page layout stuff, it doesn't look like it will be very >difficult. I wouldn't incorporate a printing function though, as I wouldn't >know how to go about doing that. > >Any other comments? A Hypercard program would be great! Everyone who gets a Mac gets Hypercard included with it which is a big selling point to me. Everyone who has a Mac could use it! About the printing...now that you mention it the printing part is not a big deal since the indexing for the disks would simply be written on the label of the disk. To be honest, I have ended up using a thick marker to write on 3.5 disks since the contents is documented elsewhere. Now it could be documented in the Hypercard program. If printing becomes important it can always be added by someone who is into that. I find printer myself to be *EVIL* and try to avoid them! :-) Neil, Do you have the article from the Feb/89 issue of Electronic Musician? I read it today and it might be helpful from a layout point of view and some ideas on using keywords you might find useful. Send me your postal mailing address and I will send you a photocopy of the article. >neil > David ------------------------------------------------------------------------ _TT /| |~ >====ttt===< | O| |~ att!osu-cis!david!david {_|||_} \| O| or n8emr!david!david David A. Roth uunet!abvax!osu-cis!david!david From CompuServ: send >internet:david@david.uucp ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- Date: Mon, 15 Jul 91 00:31:17 -0400 (EDT) >From: Neil Anthony Herzinger To: Sgroup Subject: Hypercard Program OK, I'm psyched to do this program. If anyone has suggestions, or is a more experiencend hypercard programer and wants to do it (I know a bit of scripting) I'll take comments for a week or so. I'll include the fields mentioned in David's post (he's also sending me a photocopy of the EM article) and any other requests/comments. I have most of the S-50 disks, so I can input those. Maybe once the program is written, someone else can input the S-550 disks. What ya'll say? neil -- Date: Mon, 15 Jul 91 13:17:07 -0400 (EDT) >From: Neil Anthony Herzinger To: Sgroup Subject: Re: Hypercard Program Cc: David asked me: >Neil, What version of Hypercard would you be writing this for? The reason >I am asking is that I don't have Hypercard 2.0 and there appears to be >file format differences with Hypercard 2.0 that don't allow Hypercard >programs written 2.0 to work on versions before 2.0. I'm not an expert >on all this but I thought I would mention it for you to keep it in >mind. I will write it for 1.2.5. Hypercard 2 can read 1.2.5 stacks without changing them, but it has to convert them in order to write more information. I run system 6.0.7 and when I tried Hypercard 2, it crashed alot. I'm not ready for system 7 either, so I will stick with 1.2.5. I think system 7 requires hypercard 2, but I take it the majority haven't switched... neil -- Date: Tue, 23 Jul 91 08:36 -0300 >From: Ray MacNeil Subject: S-550 display To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Does anyone in the S group with an S-550 have any advice in hooking up a black and white TV as a monitor? I have an old, small black & white TV that I wanted to use for this purpose, and I have an video game adaptor, (the one that switches from game to TV, or vice versa), anmd I thought that that would work, but it doesn't. I am getting the display on the screen so all the wires work, but the display is unreadable it's so distorted. Any suggestions other than paying Roland $50 for their adaptor? Ray MacNeil Halifax, Nova Scotia Canada -- >From: wbf@cbema.att.com Date: Tue, 23 Jul 91 13:21 EDT To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: S-550 display Hi Ray, Your problem may be that you're trying to put composite video into an antenna input. You'll have to modulate it to rf first. I'm sure Radio Shack, a video game store, or a computer store in your area will have something suitable. You can feed an rf modulator from the RCA b&w output of the S550. I'm also sending you a (long) file of some early discussions from this mailing list about a color modulator for $99.00 (US). Bill Fox -- To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: FORWARDED MAIL FOLLOWS... Date: 24 Jul 91 05:09:11 EDT (Wed) >From: david!david@cis.ohio-state.edu (David A. Roth) Subject: Re: Sampling using the Roland S330, HEEEELP! Newsgroups: rec.music.synth In-Reply-To: <1991Jul19.112438.723@axion.bt.co.uk> Organization: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. Cc: Message-Id: <9107240503.AA01472@david.UUCP> Date: 24 Jul 91 05:03:07 EDT (Wed) >From: david@david.UUCP (David A. Roth) I've already sent a reply to the poster telling him about the 'sgroup'. Meanwhile, I thought you of one might have some info on-line you could e-mail to him. David In article <1991Jul19.112438.723@axion.bt.co.uk> you write: > >After crowing on about samplers to various people for the past years, I >finally put money out and bought a Roland S330. The library disks sounded >good; strange bells, gongs, chirps, insect noises, and things which go clang >and sport strange Japanese names! The pianos sounded good enough for me to >consider selling things like the EMT10 which has done me well for the last >couple of years. What would be nice is to take the guitar, strings, choir and >upright bass off the EMT10 and onto the S330. > >Choir first, sent out a note-on message with suitable velocity, long sustained >note ... should be easy! Manual sample capture ... OK. Playback, GIGO, sounded >just what I wanted, while it lasted. OK go to the loop page set a couple of >loop points, set up the TVF/TVA and envelopes, then move to the next sample >and repeat the procedure. Those words were easy to type in, or say. At best I >was getting clicks, even after a long time spent on gathering a series of >samples of the same, and repeats of the same, steady note. At worst I ended up >with a group of demented Daleks around the sample key, and an excellent >screaming Leslie a couple of octaves up! > >I dread the guitar as it is a decaying envelope and there is no real sustained >part to speak of. One ray of hope, a TR505 and an RX11 sampled really well, >but they were all one shots and no looping was involved! > >I know the theory of doing it, and the techniques to follow to get good >results. It's the first time I've actually tried to put these into practice. >If anyone can give practical advice on using the thing I would be grateful, >probably best via EMail unless sufficient people fancy a net discussion. > >An encoded disk of choir samples wouldn't go amiss ;-) > >BTW running strings on an S330 disk reveals 'Hacker mode'! Anyone come across >this feature? I was interested in putting S330 disks into my Sun386 and then >printing out the patch and tone parameters. > >Andy > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Andy Gray Software Technology Division, SSTF/306, British Telecom > Research Labs., Martlesham Heath, Ipswich IP5 7RE, U.K. > Tel: +44 473 646647 e-mail: agray@axion.bt.co.uk -- >From: wbf@cbema.att.com Date: Thu, 25 Jul 91 08:46 EDT To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Color Modulator for S550!!!! > > From watdragon.waterloo.edu!jmsellens > > Wed Jul 24 15:03:17 0400 1991 remote from att > Date: Wed, 24 Jul 91 15:03:17 -0400 > From: "John M. Sellens" > Message-Id: <9107241903.AA06836@watdragon.waterloo.edu> > To: wbf@cbema.att.com > Subject: color modulator for S550?? > > | From nh0n+@andrew.cmu.edu Tue Jul 23 16:46:33 1991 > | From: wbf@cbema.att.com > | To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu > | Subject: S-550 display > | > | Hi Ray, > | > | Your problem may be that you're trying to put composite video into > | an antenna input. You'll have to modulate it to rf first. I'm sure Radio > | Shack, a video game store, or a computer store in your area will have > | something suitable. You can feed an rf modulator from the RCA b&w output > | of the S550. I'm also sending you a (long) file of some early discussions > | from this mailing list about a color modulator for $99.00 (US). > | > | Bill Fox > > Will this color modulator take the DB9 from the S550 and produce > a composite video signal in color? If so, I'd much appreciate any > information you could give me. > > Thanks very much! > > John Sellens > jmsellens@watdragon.waterloo.edu > Hi John, Don't you mean the digital RGB output DIN connector? Rather than resending the entire set of conversations on this topic that transpired on this list, I'll just reproduce my response here. If there are enough requests, I will repost that old conversation. Bill Fox ------------------------------------------------------ Hi S-groupers! Many thanks to all who've responded to my recent postings. Here's an update of where I stand. The STV I is out of production and the STV II is still only $99.95. Add $7.00 UPS to Ohio and I'm getting a cashier's check tonight for $106.95 to send to: PBC 11026 West Washington Blvd. Culver City, California 90230 (213) 838-6841 PBC doesn't accept plastic or personal checks (which sometimes are rubber). They designed this box expressly to go with Roland samplers because the samplers put out negative vertical sync. Everything else PBC sells is designed elsewhere as they're basically a distributor. Bill Fox